A business model for would-be third place operators? A couple of months ago I set aside the subject of The Terra Bite Lounge, an “upscale voluntary payment cafe/deli” in Kirkland, WA. I saw the item on Brand Autopsy, and other coverage has appeared in the Seattle Times and on the Kirkland Weblog.
The cafe post no prices, and does not “charge” people in the traditional sense… each person just pays what they feel is fair. They’re also welcome to drink coffee all week long and pay at the end of the week. I find the whole thing to be a very interesting concept. I expect that this will work better in some cities or parts of each city than in others… but if it’s established in an place that can draw some commuters or near a business district, it would probably be a way of funding the enterprise to keep it going, while allowing others to pay less than the going rate and have a place to hang out. A third place.
What do you think? Would this be a viable way of operating a missional third place? Or would the imposition of even a small agenda threaten the business model? Would it work in the areas that need a third place the most… and how does one define those areas?
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May 30th, 2007 at 8:21 am
Excellent idea. I think you are right that it would work better in some places than others. I really like missional third places, they are an excellent way to be part of the community, and engage with outhers outside of the “church model”. The Dusty Cover which Ywam Winnipeg are launcing really excites me to, there is just such potential there. My husband and I are moving to Canada (East Coast) either once our Permenant Residency comes through (2008) or beforehand if we raise enough support. This is what we really want to do run a third place space somewhere – it comes down to that same old thing though – financial support.
May 30th, 2007 at 9:33 am
[...] Brother Maynard has a really interesting post today about The Terra Bite Lounge which is based in Kirkland, WA. It’s a voluntary payment cafe, which is an interesting concept. I get really excited when I read on Jamie’s blog about The Dusty Cover, the third place bookstore which Ywam Winnipeg are launching later this year. In the UK I’ve recently become aware of a childrens clothes store called B@titude, which is in Leatherhead, just south of London. This clothing shop has a real community around it. People from all around donate their unwanted childrens clothes, toys etc and they are sold there, nothing is more than £2.50 ($4.50) and families come and browse and buy what they need. The difference with this small shop though, is that there is a childrens play area and a coffee area for parents. This coffee area is the hub of this shop. Everyone is welcome, some stay ten minutes, others most of the afternoon, chatting, supporting one another etc. There are special cards on the counter where people can write down any items they desperately need such as a car seat, high chair etc, and the shop will source it for them. The community within this clothes shop have brought a goat for a village in Kenya, they have funded a well in Uganda, are currently campaigning so that gypsies in the local area can have a permenant home. What a difference this small clothes shop, which has a community hub around it is making – bearing in mind that most of the people who shop there are on lower incomes themsleves. [...]
May 30th, 2007 at 2:50 pm
As you know, we are working to open a missional third place in our community (thanks for the encouraging words, Lyn!). Our plan is to offer coffee by donation as well. We are going in with the expectation that donations will not cover costs and thus subsidize. If we are pleasantly surprised, then great! Otherwise we are prepared.
We are also working on a similar approach to the books themselves, but given our neighbourhood and the market, we have to develop that more intentionally and carefully.
Peace,
Jamie
May 31st, 2007 at 7:50 am
interesting thoughts – especially for us as we continue to slowly explore the possibility of building a cafe on the green space beside knox. On the practical side, given the disastrous impact of prolonged addiction / substance abuse, I wonder how one could avoid exponential growth in that community that would then cause paying customers to avoid the place. We can’t even consistently offer food / refreshments after church – we do it on a random basis now . . .
June 2nd, 2007 at 7:24 am
Yeah … I’m going to push back a little. ;-) Why impose an “agenda” on your friendships? Why just be who you are, which is mostly defined by Christ, and be friends with people? Then open whatever kind of third space you want. It will be Jesus-like by it’s nature, because you are … not because of some “agenda” you are setting. People in our cultures sniff out agendas (especially a Christian agenda) far more easily than we think. They don’t want to hear one more person talking the talk. But they’ll be pretty interested in watching someone walking the walk … without talking or making an agenda out of it. Maybe be really subversive ;-) …
June 2nd, 2007 at 7:28 am
oh … c@*# … that third sentence should be “Why not just be who you are, …”
June 2nd, 2007 at 10:28 am
Sonja,
I hear what you are saying (I even blogged on this some time ago). However, I don’t necessarily think that having a loving intention is the same as having an agenda. I think there is a risk of being too neutral. Just a thought.
Peace,
Jamie
June 3rd, 2007 at 7:03 pm
Jamie …
I totally agree with that … having intentional friendships that are not based on an agenda are great. Thanks for clarifying …
pax, Sonja
June 4th, 2007 at 9:26 am
Since I’m from Winnipeg…
The Grace Cafe does an excellent job of providing great food and coffee/beverages, but a few things immediately stand out:
1. With a name like “Grace Cafe”, it’s obviously a Christian place, and
2. The clientele (when I’ve visited) has been obviously church people enjoying church fellowship in a third space that is alcohol-free and “nice”. I know the original owner’s vision was more akin to “third space”, but that’s not how it’s turned out. The churchianity crew took it over and their $$ keeps it afloat, so what can the owners do?
3. The suburban location doesn’t help. The only people looking for a cafe that far away are the church people who already know where to find it.
And I agree with Jamie that there’s a trap of neutrality that leads to passivity if we view “intentional” as synonymous with “agenda”. I don’t like agenda-driven friendships (I have met some Christians with this kind of drive-through mentality, and like Sonja, I think it leaves a bad smell), but being intentional doesn’t have to be agenda-driven.
June 6th, 2007 at 5:55 pm
I realize that perhaps this conversation has dwindled and no one is listening anymore, but this has been perking around in my head for a while. So I’ll put it out here and see what happens.
We (my husband and I) have stumbled into the “third space” of my daughter’s hockey team. This is very clearly a community for these people. I was invited by the coach to be the team manager for the coming year. So I’ve taken on that task. I’ll do it to the best of my abilities and I’ll be intentional with my desire to engage in a relational style with the girls and the parents. To approach problem solving from a Christ-like perspective which involves mediation and redemption rather than confrontation, discipline, and being “right.” I may never talk openly about my faith, but I may plant seeds. It’s my hope that engaging in that relational style combined with prayer and guidance from my support network will at least give me some conversations. But if it doesn’t … well … I’ve still done what I was called to do. And I’ll still have some good friends.
June 8th, 2007 at 12:54 am
’s-alright, Sonja — I’m still here ;^) I think you’re right-on about the hockey team… along the lines of things said here in the past.
Rob — I’ve never been to Grace cafe; I always figured the name told me all I’d ever need to know… including the liklihood that nobody gets very good tips there.
As for agendas and friendship, I figure you have to choose. Can’t have both… but it’s a trick question, because you’ll never accomplish your agenda without friendship, while having the agenda will prevent the friendship. Tread carefully.
Bill, you’ve got a puzzling question there. I could see the novelty of your proposed cafe style drawing paying customers. I wonder about changing the pricing model according to the hours. Coffee’s free from 10:30-11:30am and 2:00-5:00pm. Just thinking aloud.
July 18th, 2007 at 2:32 pm
Bro:
All your posts re; Third Place have been so helpful to our community (http://www.3dff.com)as we transition..
I just posted on s few of the surprises we see coming:
http://davewainscott.blogspot.com/2007/07/third-place-serendipities.html
You may have noted I added links to your post and a few others by church bloggers to the Third Place wikipedia article