Daryl Dash blogs a blurb from Rick Warren’s Ministry Toolbox which offers a healthier EC in three [easy] steps as well as another one about not forgetting the 5 purposes. Aauckphtht. It amounts to “be more like us” — Daryl aptly highlights the church growth one.
Yuck. To stretch (or does it?) an analogy, this is like trying to fix a Chevy by saying it’s not a Ford, and then attempting to strap on a Ford drivetrain to remedy the problem. It won’t work people! Listen: You can’t fix something you don’t understand by changing it into something you do understand!
Daryl takes the opportunity to link a chart from Robert Webber’s book, The Younger Evangelicals posted by Jordan Cooper which I’ve been looking for an excuse to link as well… and this is it. As Daryl observes, Saddleback and the emerging church are in two different columns here…. not the same thing. The chart itself is a helpful comparison of three generations or types of evangelical thought and practice.
Webber’s book in its entirey is also definitely worth a read. I’d put in the “top five” category for reading in order to understand the transition we find ourselves in.
I’ve been thinking, a lot of the ec talk is wonderful but I just wonder what it would look like if folks just stayed the heck away from all that they are attempting to escape or emerge from. For example, why give DA Carson any credit? Rick Warren knows nothing about the emerging church and I supsectvery little about “CHurch.” I actually like Rick Warrebn for what he has done over the years, but I don’t think Rick Warren or Joel Olsteen are preaching the “Gopsel” no damn wonder so many folks are sick of eating Krispy Kreme Donuts, they taste good at first but you can’t survive off of them. The same with Rick Warren theology.
At the outset I’d like to pint out that post-modernism is NOT a generational thing. There are post-moderns who are post-moderns who are 80. There are moderns who are 18. Yes, Generation X is the first generation whergeneration where post-modernism is mindset of the majority, but it’s downright ignorant to think of it as a youth thing.
Lord, spare us from our leaders.
Huh? Slow up a minute… Nobody’s really talking about generational stuff in this thread… it’s just a book title. I don’t know if Webber ties his terms to age, but I have the impression he’s talking about eras of evangelicalism more than anything else… and drawing a distinction between modern and postmodern evangelicalism. The first two comment-ers and I are all of similar ages, which is decidedly above the average age of the ‘busters who are typically mis-named “Gen-X” and are primarily postmodern. Boomers and older are typically modern, but not exclusively – Gen-X is a mix, and it’s actually not very clear which way the majority would go. If you want to know what Gen-X actually is, read this post. Because you’re in Australia, you would be considered Gen-X… but if you’d been born in Canada or the USA, you would not be, you’d be a ‘buster. It’s not as simple as a popular label, never is. Gen-X, properly defined, doesn’t even qualify as “youth” anymore.
Nobody around here is under any illusions that we’re dealing with anything like a simple generation gap… if you’re attempting to convince us that you don’t have to be young to be postmodern, it’s probably because you’ve just never met us (but stick around…) The shift to postmodernism is a change in epoch, and has nothing to do with age. As a generalization, the young tend to take to it easier because there’s less to unlearn, they’re growing up in an age of postmodernism — whereas more, uh, vintage persons have more modernist influence to shake off. Just generalizing, mind you, but that’s the only real connection between age and a change in epochs.
Back on point, I think the gist of what’s being said here is simply that the Rick Warren tribe is attempting to modernize the emerging church so they can organize it “properly.” btw, I enjoyed my quick visit to your blog — I’ll have to return for more… noticed your own take on Purpose-Driven-Missional, and really enjoyed the quote about Harry Potter and Fred Flinstone!
Best,